Episode 90: Ed Decker

The God Makers

John Larsen interviews Ed Decker, the author the God Makers and founder of Saints Alive in Jesus.

Saints Alive
The God Makers
The God Makers Film
To Moroni With Love

Episode 90

53 comments on “Episode 90: Ed Decker”

  1. Chino_Blanco Reply

    As one of the New ExMormons (à la mode New Atheist), I’ll never be a member of Ed’s target audience, but that interview was (surprisingly) vitriol-free and I wound up glad to have listened in. Maybe Ed has finally mellowed after 75 years? Anyways, cheers to John and Ed for a discussion that was more personal than polemical.

  2. Swearing Elder Reply

    I’ve only heard nasty things about Ed so I was pleasantly surprised by this interview. I’ve never read the Godmakers or seen the film so this was really my only exposure to him other than the rumors I’ve heard. Thanks for having him on the podcast.

  3. Swearing Elder Reply

    I’ve only heard nasty things about Ed so I was pleasantly surprised by this interview. I’ve never read the Godmakers or seen the film so this was really my only exposure to him other than the rumors I’ve heard. Thanks for having him on the podcast.

  4. Shauna Reply

    I think that these other comments and the references to Ed that usually accompany his name are just another “testament” to looking at things from both sides before coming to a conclusion. The process of logical thinking is something usually left out when you are “praying to know if this or that is true”, same thing goes for fear based teachings and when someone challenges those teachings and asks you to look at it from another angle….you have been TOLD YOUR conclusion should be that is wrong…now run.
    Where would we be without examining every angle? You have to hear both sides and somewhere in the middle is usually the truth.
    Interesting podcast.

  5. Oz Reply

    I was honestly shocked to see that you had Ed Decker as a guest when I opened up my iTunes this morning. The flood of memories from my mission in the South came back instantly. It seemed like his movie or the book was distributed with the morning paper, it was everywhere. Ed Decker’s book actually got us into more homes more often than not. Most people heard about it at their churches, then we would come knocking, and they were curious to know if we actually believed the crazy things in the book. Thanks to him, he actually kept us busy and successful.

    Now to the book. I was so curious about all the things we were hearing about it, we went to our local Christian Bookstore and bought a copy. I read it and thought that it was just ridiculous, exaggerated lies. Of course, I knew very little/nothing about our own doctrine and how it was developed, and the First Vision story was the extent of my Church History knowledge at that time. I remember just being pissed about the attitude of the book, I felt mocked. I wish I would have kept it, but we ceremoniously burnt it in a field. Now that I am a little more aware/familiar with our history and doctrine, I’d be curious to read it again and see how off my feelings were at the time. Something tells me, accurate or not, I’d still feel mocked. Great Job John!!!! Thanks Ed for sharing your life experience with us on the podcast!!!

  6. Aaron Reply

    I was surprised when I opened up my podcast subscriptions and saw an interview with Ed Decker. Overall, I liked the interview. There were some things I noticed in this interview about Ed Decker’s life that he changed…. AGAIN. I have kind of gotten use to the fact that Ed Decker keeps changing his story of why he left Mormonism. I am still skeptical of whether or not the book or movie THE GOD MAKERS was fact checked because there are glaring factual errors in both. The second film THE GOD MAKERS 2 was even worse. I don’t feel too left out of Ed Decker’s sloppy criticism…. he does the same poor treatment for Freemasons and Roman Catholics as well. I have heard of several Evangelical Christians criticize his work, many of whom also speak out against Mormonism or Catholicism. So, while I really enjoy this interview, I still feel we will never really know the real Ed Decker. Personally, I feel he will never be fully honest with anyone about his work.

  7. Jason Reply

    I was glad to hear this interview. But I have to admit that Ed jumped the shark for me when he claimed that Free Masons tried to poison him. Maybe he’s right, I dunno, but it just sounded really outlandish to me.

  8. Randy Snyder Reply

    In my journey regarding religion I have never been able to identify with Ed. When I was a TBM, he was a boogeyman character that spread lies and hate about my faith. When I went on my faith crisis, I didn’t trust overtly anti-Mormon material, especially from Evangelicals, so Ed’s work didn’t make the cut. Now that I’ve landed as a naturalist, Ed’s brand of faith is just another flavor of an illogical belief system, no more valid or crazy than the Mormon narrative. I love his claim that he believes in the “uncompromised Gospel of Jesus Christ.” Euphemism for my preferred Christian narrative.

    But still, it was really interesting to humanize this guy who was once such a hated but really faceless boogeyman from my past.

    • G Reiersen Reply

      I know what you mean about overtly anti-Mormon material. When I saw how much of this material contained blatant lies and exaggerations, it actually strengthened my confidence in the LDS Church. I figured that if it really were necessary to lie so to discredit Mormonism, then it must be true after all. Ironically, I also eventually found things in Church approved publications and statements by the Church’s foremost advocates and leaders that inadvertently did as much or more damage to its own credibility, in my mind, as some of the best intentioned efforts of even its honest critics and skeptics could have!

    • Drbobfunk Reply

      Dear Randy–you threw out the baby with the bathwater–yet u still attack people,and their material-God makers would never have been published&all footnotes had to be rechecked.No law suit has ever been successful about the primary documentation in the Godmakers book.The film was highly charged&emotional for me a laid back Canadian–however you have to just hand it to Ed for his faithfulness to a great cause-helping many Lds.see where they are truly tri-theistic and closer to islam–For you my friend–you have gravitated to where there is still no hope–Dawkins et al—so what s new the fool has said in his heart there is no god—dont be a fool–the is intelligent design–not false juggling of eternal matter as Mormons believe–bow your heart and spirit and go with WHO is responsible for your very existence–I ll pray for you.Read William Lane Craig s God is Great-God is good. Regards DRF Honduras

        • Randy Snyder Reply

          Whoops, I guess you already are. Keep it up. I have read God is Not Great by Hitchens. Is that close enough to the Craig book?

          • Guest

            Actually you need to see Craigs book to see how Hitchens misses the mark in not following the law of non contradiction and others–Hitchens once said in a debate with FRank Turek that after accomplishing what you can in life–there s really not much left -but a straight run out-meaning to die–which is what he s doing now of cancer if you havent read-and he still refuses prayer

          • Randy Snyder

            Well, we all die and no amount of wishful thinking changes our mortality. I’m aware of Hitchen’s cancer. But you seem surprised he wouldn’t turn to prayer. This is a very annoying disconnect in the brains of believers, the ridiculous notion that nobody, deep down, is truly a non believer in God, especially when they are facing death (no atheists in a foxhole).

            You know, I have absolutely no doubt that you really believe in your notion of deity; that you believe your chosen and favorite God is real. Why is it so hard for you people to wrap your melons around the fact that atheists’ convictions are every bit as deep as yours? I’ve even taken measures to make sure my funeral has NO theology in it.

  9. G Reiersen Reply

    Thank you for interviewing Ed Decker. This interview made me realize just how much he has been maligned and demonized by many in the LDS church, in most case I’m sure, by people who don’t know the full story about him. I don’t give any more credence to his current religious beliefs than I do to LDS beliefs (or any other religious dogmas), but I commend you for giving him a chance to express his views and clear up some of the misconceptions that I and many other others with a Mormon background have held about him. The one religious precept that I firmly subscribe to is the ideal of dealing honestly, compassionately and fairly with our fellow beings, as we would like others to deal with us. This is the baby that must not be thrown out with the bathwater! I have little doubt that Ed Decker, in his own way, tries to live up to that ideal, based on what he told you in the interview. To the extent that the LDS Church is successful in influencing its membership to accept and practice that ideal, I still honor it.

    • Drbobfunk Reply

      yes–that ideal must be practised by us all-but remember where that came from–or rather WHO spoke it on the mount of beatitudes–however —-one must be honest and speak the truth in love(Eph4)and yes contend also(Jude3)however in love again as you say.Lets hear the truth(mormon prophet)and if you can show us where we have failed–we will be so thankful for that….and lets also not just do what we re told and go with that as it could lead the ship in the wrong direction(When the prophet speaks the thinking has been done–1945 Sunday School manual).Be wise as serpents and harmless as doves—61,000missionaries mostly follow this line…..

      • G Reiersen Reply

        Jesus Christ was neither the only nor the first one to express that ideal. It is an ideal that makes very good sense whether or not one believes in God and a hereafter, and even whether or not there actually IS a god or gods. So important is this ideal that, by comparison, all other religious precepts (including even the question of whether or not there actually is a god) are irrelevant chaff that too often tends to obscure that ideal and even interfere with its implementation by inspiring distrust and hatred of others who don’t happen to share one’s own religious belief system.

  10. Joseph Reply

    My deconversion from Mormonism occurred as part of my disaffection from literalist Christianity, which puts me at odds with most evangelicals (who share with Mormons a tendency to presuppose the historicity of Jesus and the literal truth / infallibility of the Bible). That being said, I still see where Ed is coming from with his emphasis on transformative principles (love, “grace”) as opposed to nit-picking commandments (don’t sin in the following bajillion ways: read Leviticus). I think there is definitely room (and need) for more such discourse in Mormonism, even as I admit that for myself the debate as framed is rather pointless, depending on the historical reality of events (like the life of Jesus) which I have come to see as mythical. That being said, I (like others) am grateful to see that Ed Decker is actually a really nice guy.

  11. Anonymous Reply

    This was great! Thanks to Ed for allowing the interview and to John for setting it up.

    I first ran into “The Godmakers” in book form, back in 1986 I think. My sister’s boyfriend had been given the book by his mother who didn’t want him to become Mormon (since my sister and I were a minor influence on him) but he didn’t want to believe it so he asked us about it. I was 15 or 16 and didn’t know much about my church so we went to Deseret Bookstore in Albuquerque NM and I stole him a copy of “The Truth About The Godmakers” because I couldn’t afford it and was really into shoplifting at the time. He never read either book but said he was comforted that there were answers and a rebuttal so his mind was at ease about it. He never joined or even took the discussions. We weren’t THAT active anyway and only attended once a month or so.

    5 years later, while serving my mission in Norway I came across the video form. I was super surprised to see The Godmakers had made it to Norway and was even translated to Norwegian and for sale in several bookstores (not only Christian ones). The cover showed a couple dressed in their temple clothes and looked scary as hell! Like a cult. I began to see why people were scared to let us in their doors.

    A girl we were teaching (she was 17 or 18) who was being raised in a very Christian family and was close to committing to baptism (she promised she would be baptized if she received the affirming answer we were confident she would.) was given a copy by her father who “forced” her to watch the movie before deciding. He said if she still wanted to get baptized after watching it, she would have his support.

    So my companion and I and some of her friends who were also considering baptism went to her house to watch it with her. She set it up that way so we could be there to answer questions as they came up, rather than later. We watched it and quite enjoyed it, trying hard to laugh our way through it to make it less frightening for our investigators. (It is filled with foreboding music, which contributes greatly to a dreadful, frightful atmosphere.) I honestly think it is masterfully made, much like any good propaganda film is. Although we tried to brush off the more disturbing accusations (garments, temple rituals, blood atonement, plural wives, etc.) we really couldn’t shake the feeling that this movie was in fact mostly accurate about our faith. She never did get baptized. I think credit for that should go to Ed and the team who made the film. So for that I am truly grateful to Ed even though I think the movie is slightly deceptive and manipulative. (It changes John Taylor’s quote about Joseph and Jesus to make Joseph *more* important than, rather than greater than all men EXCEPT Jesus. That’s the biggest of several minor untruths.) This was back in 1992. I am still in contact with this girl (woman now) and she is happier than ever, has a wonderful family with two children, and is not active in any form of religion. (I think she considers herself agnostic.) However her sister (2 years older, who refused to watch the film with us) is still very Christian. I shudder to think how she would be now had she been baptized and remained Mormon all this time.

    I am ashamed to say that to help discredit the film my companion and I spread the rumors we had heard about Ed: That he was excommunicated for adultery, was a child molester, and more. It is horrible and I feel very bad about it, especially now that I have heard his side of the story. Ed seems like a very kind, sincere, good man whom I would be glad to be friends with.

    Of course, my current life views are aligned pretty much with John’s and other contributers here (Nyal, Jim, Zilpha, Seth, etc), so I don’t believe Ed has found the truth any more than Mormons have. But thanks to this podcast I have a greater amount of sympathy for mainstream Christianity or Evangelism – which I never respected much before, frankly. I even feel that maybe Ed’s Christianity is a better form than Mormonism, which I never would have thought. (For years now I have considered them all equally poisonous.)

    So kudos to Ed for setting the record straight and making a sympathizer out of this hard-core atheist. Cheers! 🙂

    • G Reiersen Reply

      I second Glenn’s admiration of your insights. Your posts often leave me saying to myself “I wish I had said that!”

      • Anonymous Reply

        Thanks Gunnar! Now I feel all warm and fuzzy. 🙂

        Oh, and I *must* return the compliment. So many of your posts leave me wishing I could be so eloquent and tactful. You’re a good example to me! So is Glenn. His manner of adding humor to the sting is a true gift and a priceless commodity.

        • G Reiersen Reply

          Oh, and thank you for your own kind words, and I don’t think you are any more deficient in the tact department than I am.

    • Drbobfunk Reply

      Dear Friend
      I admire your openess and honesty about Ed and the film etc.Sad that your near convert went to atheism,when these could have been better years for her&you.
      If you as a mormon or atheist are right about their being a sort of purgatory-spirit psion for the bad ones—then we all have a chance at the lowest degree of glory–however if the reverse is true–why take a chance on eternal separation from God??__Really,as you call Ed sort of a gentleman—God is MORE–&He wont violate your decision to be without HIM–hence why shouldnt He (if Hes really true-what is truth??)leave you alone WITHOUT HIM for all eternity?(if any mormonism remains check out Alma 34:33 and Hebrews):27–there is no work you can do after this life(means no vicarious baptisms)to prepare for eternity–and a judgement remains.However if you say that there could be a divine purpose for all of us–se how a resurrected Christ can change you now before its too late–IICor.5:17/John1:2/5:24–be well for now.DrRF_Honduras

  12. Glowstickgorilla Reply

    John,

    I think it would make a great show to assemble the panel and review the “Mormon cartoon”. Much like you did with the 14 fundamentals talk

    • Drbobfunk Reply

      This was exactly done in a less charged video called the Mormon Dilemna-with Jim Spencer ex LDS-past Ricks College editor
      (Jeremiah Films).

  13. Scott Reply

    The God Makers did more to keep me in the church than anything else. Too many parts were wild exaggerations and these made me doubt the validity of other arguments which I found later to be fairly damning of Mormonism.

    Decker is just trying to move someone from one irrational belief system to another. I try to steer Mormons and non-Mormons alike away from his work. A website like this is a MUCH better source for investigating Mormonism.

    • camp Reply

      So true. I never put much credence in The Godmakers because it seemed to so extreme. After listening to this podcast, I got the definite impression that Mr. Decker has a few screws that need tightening.

      • Drbobfunk Reply

        dont we all have a few screws loose?sometimes?Controlling our anger etc etc??
        What does it matter–if in the end we ll be all powder anyway??
        However–IF your survives-somewhere-only church of the devil&church of Christ(BOM) why worry about ED and not yourself?ALL have sinned and come short of God s glory-standard–can you go with that?Romans 3:23,6:23,Hebrews 10:31

  14. Richard H. Reply

    Great Podcast and glad to see the human side of Ed Decker. I was hoping to hear a little about “The God Makers II” video since he does not sell it on his site anymore. I know it had some pretty crazy claims.

    Learned a few things bout him including (according to him) being poisoned by the Masons being hit my a Metro Bus. I always believe he was excommunicated for Adultery and his wife left him since that is what I was told but in reality he was in the Church another 7 years after his divorce.

    Good Job John and thanks Ed for the interview. Learned many great things about you.

  15. MJL Reply

    Ah, Ed Decker. It’s nice to see the self-aggrandizing man that I have come to know and grow quickly tired of hasn’t changed a bit.

    Regarding “The God Makers” film I found it laugh out loud funny when I first saw it. As a TBM I too heard of its nefarious reputation as a “testimony killer” but being the curious individual I am I had to see it. Thanks to the internet I finally saw it and I found it to be a joke. I was well aware of the doctrine Ed was exposing but the sensationalist tone by which he presented it came off as unsophisticated tabloid journalism that undermined its credibility.

    I mean, come on! How can you take a man seriously who claims to have been poisoned by the Masons? I can see why so many professional ex-mormons wish to distance themselves from him.

    Speaking of funny has anyone here seen the Hammer remix of the God Makers cartoon?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=46PXaJxzuDE

    Make sure you’re not eating anything when watching it.

  16. Erikmdavis1968 Reply

    Wow… what an amazing interview! Seems like Ed is not the hate filled person I was told as I grew up in the church. Now that I am older and am out of the church I look back and see why he was so polarizing. No one else seemed to have the guts to confront the church on the level that he did. No wonder he was attacked so heavily. I applaud you for this interview and hope that others out there enjoy it as much as I did.

  17. Fred Reply

    In case there’s any doubt left I am an Evangelical Christian. However, I’ve never thought much of Ed Decker as my review of The God Makers demonstrates (see http://www.amazon.com/review/R1LYUCXCJ6L1VV/ref=cm_cr_dp_perm?ie=UTF8&ASIN=B000T9JL7K&nodeID=130&tag=&linkCode= )

    So I was pleasantly surprised by this interview as most I have heard Mr. Decker’s default “Born Again tough guy jerk” personality dominates.

    I’m not going to recant any of the criticism that I’ve had of Mr. Decker’s outlandish behavior, shoddy scholarship, and questionable methods over the years but at least it’s good to know that there’s another, softer, more human side to the man.

    Great job as usual Mormon Expression!

    • Fred Reply

      And here’s an idea for a future podcast . . .

      For your listening pleasure, edification and education Mormon Expression Presents . . .

      The Great Debate: Mike “TBM” Tannehill v. Ed “Anti” Decker
      (aka “Smackdown M: Apocalypse Now!”)

      And I would like to purchase the movie and TV broadcast rights!

  18. Glenn Reply

    I admit, I have never seen or read the godmakers, although I remember hearing about it when I was a kid. I just watched the “banned mormon cartoon” on youtube. It says that Orson Pratt taught that Jesus married at least three wives and bore children with them. I haven’t heard that before, but it doesn’t sound like such a stretch (move over Dan Brown). But what is the source for Joseph Smith claiming that he was a direct descendant of Jesus? I have never heard that before. That sounds a little fishy to me — although not beyond the realm of believability. Does anyone have a reference?

  19. Julia Reply

    Thanks for another great interview, John. And thank you, Ed, for participating. As a TBM, Ed’s work was considered the worst of the worst when it came to anti. As a dutiful, obedient saint I was never even in the same room with it. Although, occasionally I’d hear about it from a nevermo boyfriend who wanted to get the low down on the church before committing himself to me. Luckily, it scared him off and I am where I am now: out and happy about it. It was so freeing to finally read “anti” material and take it for what it is…information. The marketplace of ideas is messy and noisy! Listening to this interview contributed to my healing journey out of mormonism. My brain and experiences are expanding because Ed: the boogieman of exmormonism is now Ed: another human being doing what he believes is right. Thanks!

  20. Jake Reply

    I was surprised that John did not confront Ed Decker on any of the many disputed claims in his work. For example, the film “The God Makers II” claims Gordon B. Hinckley kept a “party pad” in the 1960s where he entertained both male and female prostitutes! Does anyone seriously believe if there were an ounce of truth in this that this man would have ever become prophet? The evidence for this, as well as many other of the film’s sensational charges was seriously challenged by none other than the Tanners (hardly Mormon apologists). The main purpose of the interview seemed to be to put a human face on someone who is reviled within Mormonism. However, I believe a man who has built his career and reputation on unfounded accusations and sloppy schloarship should be held to account.

  21. ambark Reply

    Years ago I made a new friend who, early in the friendship, informed me that she had watched the Godmakers and wanted to know if we really believed that Satan and Jesus were brothers. Being the good little TBM that I was, I had never seen the movie (though heard of it). Frankly, it scared the sh!t out of me to have this subject brought up and I never talked to her again.

    I just watched the Godmakers. Wish I’d seen it sooner (and been aware of the true history of mormonism). It wasn’t that far out. I could have had a reasonable conversation with this friend — and kept her friendship. I think it would actually help mormons to get a little more familiar with these things, with their own history, and quit being so scared and defensive whenever someone disagrees with them (like I was).

    While I don’t agree with everything Ed Decker said and stands for, he is sort of like a mirror who could help mormons see themselves more clearly (if they weren’t too scared and “obedient” to look).

  22. Aaron Shafovaloff Reply

    Probably the biggest reason evangelical countercult ministries have distanced ourselves from Ed Decker is his lack of repentance of the grossly unsubstantiated claims in Godmakers 2, and the way he treated his critics (including Sandra Tanner from UTLM) afterwards.

    Sandra Tanner talks a little bit about the former here:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6UoxVoxF_A#t=30m49s (see 30m49s)

    Also see Issue 84 of The Sale Lake City Messenger:

    http://www.utlm.org/newsletters/no84.htm

  23. Earl Reply

    John,
    I just finished listening to the interview with Ed Decker and was ecouraged by the courage it took to post on your website. Your warning to LDS folks at the beginning was very respectful to their faith toward that which they view is sacred.

    As I listened to Ed share his life story and “sincerity”, as you put it, I was pleased that you were one of the few LDS faithful that didn’t go into a defending rampage. Surprisingly, you responded, as I hope other LDS would, with a desire to win him back to your faith.

    Typically when a Biblical Christian desires to enter into a conversation about validity in the LDS doctrine it is met with contention, mockery, and rage. This pushes that person further from the LDS faith than winning them to the LDS “restored gospel”.

    However, I was disappointed by something during the interview. You were repeatedly laughing at places where it seemed inappropriate to be laughing. This caused me to wonder if it was 1. nervous laughter, 2. protective laughter, or 3. that which is described in Proverbs 29:9?

    BTW, if you choose to read the above proverb I would encourage you to read the next verse as well. Solomon appropriately describes the LDS responses about Ed Decker since he spoke against the church as well as Ed’s own heart toward those who maligned him. He is the “just” who is seeking after the souls of men.

    Great job for finally giving Ed the opportunity to share his love for Jesus and the LDS people.

    • Randy Snyder Reply

      Earl, I’m not sure you understand much about John and his current position on the LDS church and religion in general. I hate to speak for John, but I think it is safe to say he would not be considered “faithful” by any standards any bishop would set forth. And secondly, I don’t think he cares about bringing anyone to the LDS gospel, or any other religion for that matter.

      But I agree that John was brave and considerate during this whole interview. Kudos John!

  24. Jesse Reply

    Thanks Ed for coming on and doing this, it was good to hear your side of things. I don’t blame John for not pushing back against Ed’s evangelicalism, just like he doesn’t push back against the LDS apologists on the show. Ed was a guest and told his side, fair enough. Also, I think Ed sounds like a nice, sincere guy who has good intentions, even if he is a bit myopic in his approach. I think it is great that he’s so dedicated and the charity work he’s done sounds awesome. Ed, if you’re reading this, I hope your health improves!

    Having said that, I think Ed does a disservice to the whole movement of ex-mormonism by continuously being sensational and attacking the church on some of the most ridiculous grounds. This allows TBMs to easily dismiss anti-mormonism. I did this as a believer, going to church pageants or big events where evangelicals would protest, their ideas never really resonated with me. Ex: Ed’s story of the ONE thing that would bring him back to the church was where the atonement happened and its details? That makes no sense to me. As a kid I distinctly remember seeing signs from evangelical groups at a large church pageant that read “Jesus paid the price on the cross, not in the garden” and thought ‘Is that the best they’ve got?’ It is so easily dismissed, almost a trivial detail (and yes, I understand there is more to it than the location, but still…) I know they want to convert people to their brand of Christianity (and thus attack mormonism from internal religious perspective) but for me as a TBM that reinforced my belief that anti-mormons were just Christian zealots with no real ammunition. This same experience happened years later when a Christian preacher told me that Mormons teach God had physical sex with Mary. Sure, that’s weird I thought, but it didn’t matter because it didn’t contradict my worldview even if it were true. I think telling members about stuff like JS’s wives or the Book of Abraham is a lot more effective than trying to tell members they are closer to Islam than Christianity. Give us a break, what a joke. I don’t believe in Mormonism anymore but I’d staunchly defend the LDS members as being Christian, at least in a broad sense. I was raised to love Jesus, to think about Jesus, to worship him and to appreciate his atonement. If you’re not calling that Christian then you’re excluding lots of other religions that worship and love Jesus, albeit under a slightly different theology. Ed even admitted that most members love Christ and worship him. Telling Mormons (who genuinely believe in Christ) that they aren’t Christians is ridiculous, especially when there are hundreds of other testimony shattering things you could say. You lose credibility and come off as totally weak. Tell Mormons about the Kinderhook plates, or Adam-God, or racism in the BoM, etc.

    Lastly, it is clear that Ed doesn’t have much of a clue about non-belief. He speaks pretty arrogantly about his brand of Christianity being the ONLY logical biblical interpretation, which is just absurd if you know how the bible was made and what it actually says. But this is a problem with all religious groups, they just have nothing to offer to educated former believers. The bible has its own massive problems of credibility and morality. The Abraham/Isaac story makes me want to barf. Noah’s flood was an awful, horrible thing and historically didn’t happen. I’m constantly amazed at how religious people don’t understand atheism and how much freedom it brings to so many people. I don’t feel like I’ve thrown out any baby with the bathwater, I’m confidently MORE moral, more loving, I’d even say more Christ-like as an atheist (and for far better reasons) than I ever was as a believer. I really understand Ed’s perspective, and the perspective of faithful LDS members, but quite sure they have no clue about the perspective of non-belief, based on their ignorance in speaking about it.

  25. Clay Painter Reply

    Bravo on the Decker interview. I have been on podcast hiatus and this was a good welcome back.

    Fascinating individual that has been unduly demonized; however, when he spoke of secret meetings, and arsenic poisoning, I began to scratch my head a bit…

  26. Clay Painter Reply

    Bravo on the Decker interview. I have been on podcast hiatus and this was a good welcome back.

    Fascinating individual that has been unduly demonized; however, when he spoke of secret meetings, and arsenic poisoning, I began to scratch my head a bit…

  27. Will D Reply

    He seems a little prone to embellishing things.  And a little too impressed with Ed Decker.    

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  29. Xerxes028 Reply

    So I know I’m new to this (we can’t all have been faithful listeners from the get go) podcast, but did anyone else get the feeling that Ed Decker is a bit of a blowhard and disingenuous?  A lot of the things he said toward the end (question of Mormons being Christians) made me question if he didn’t go to some obscure off-shoot of the church under Brigham Young instead of the mainstream church of today.

  30. Pingback: Ed Decker and The God Makers | Trudging Toward the Telestial Kingdom

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